Ramones und Sex Pistols

[Herrrmann]

hmm, irgendwie ein wirrer thread *g* ...
"fathers of punkrock", sowatt hab ich ja noch nie gehört...
Gruß, Rouven

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

war das nicht das was in den 60ern als "Garagerock" vermarktet wurde?

 

[Supertyp]

Jau Garage,

Crypt Rec. aus den USA haben da nen teilweise tollen Backkatalog mit Samplern, auf denen nur alte 60er Jahre Garage Bands drauf sind.

Im Prinzip nix anderes als Beat Musik, schrammeliger und schneller gespielt mit ein bißchen Rock'n'Roll dabei.

Heute orientieren sich Bands wie die Hives an so nem Sound.

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

ich weiss nicht warum aber irgendwie erinnern mich auch The (International) Noise Conspiracy an den Sound...

 

[Supertyp]

Stimmt, kommen irgendwie aus der Ecke.

Aber den Passus "Fathers of punk rock" hab ich auch noch nich gehört.
Kenn ich zwar von SKA und Soul, aber Punk Rock,neee.

Hier gehts doch gerade darum, daß man machen kann was man will.

Mit sowas setzt man Punk Rock doch ein bißchen Pop gleich, indem bestimmte Vorbilder auf nen Thron gesetzt werden, obwohl es gar kein Königreich zum regieren gibt.

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

Recht hat der Mann

 

[Herrrmann]

jau, des find ich aber auch hehe...
Gruß, Rouven

 

[destroyer]

ok, ich werde es euch erklären.

die genre punk wird in folgende untergernes unterteilt:

punkrock
hardcore punk
emo punk
ska punk

die sexpistols spielten punk, heute würde man das als hardcore punk bezeichen. und die RAMONES die hatten mit dem punkrock angefangen, darum sind sie auch die väter davon, klar?

mfg desi

 

[Herrrmann]

lol, sorry, aber des is so mit das bekloppteste was ich je gehört hab...
"die genre punk wird in folgende untergernes unterteilt..."
erstma heisst des "das Genre" und zweitens is das blödsinn.
wer hat das denn deiner meinung nach festgelegt ?
irgendwie wiederspricht des meiner vorstellung von punk rock...
naja meister, viel spass noch .

 

[jeff]

definitiv IGGY, IGGY, IGGY!!!

aber IMHO auch THE WHO! das ist auf alle fälle PUNK.

zumindest wenn man sich die scheiben: live at leeds und the kids are alright anhöhrt!

(übrigens entwisstle spielte ne weile lang danelectro bässe weil das die einzigen waren die umwickelte seiten hatten. waren die seiten feddich hat er das ding geschrottet und nen neuen gekauft!!!
das is punk, alden! )

 

[Supertyp]

Na der Destroyer ist ja en riesen Fachmann.

Seid wann sind die Sex Pistols denn Hardcore Punk, da hätt ich aber mal gerne ne Begründung zu.

Ich bitte ferner darum, hier Emo nicht in Verbindung mit Punk Rock zu bringen.
Die Seitenscheitel-Hornbrillen Typen können gerne heulen worüber sie wollen, solange et nich hier ist.

 

[Rojos]

Bands like The Who and The Stooges definately paved the way for the possibility of there ever being punk rock. Iggy Pop & The Stooges are an excellent example of early punk rock 'The Stooges' . Iggy's Detroit brothers The MC5 brought some of the wildest energy to the stage that I've ever seen. 'Kick Out the Jams'

New York, early 1970's. Young, virtually unknown artists like Patti Smith, the Velvet Underground, and the New York Dolls brought about a new style of "alternative" entertainment, rooted in a "do-it-yourself" attitude. Short, frenetic songs, aggressive, sometimes confrontational stage presence, and angry messages against consumerism hit the stages at venues like New York's CBGB's, starting the movement that would be known as punk rock.

'Velvet Underground & Nico'

Actually you could listen to pretty much any VU album but, I chose this one for the song "Heroin"

New York Dolls '20th Century Masters: Millennium Collection'
Patti Smith 'Horses'
Television 'Marquee Moon'
Talking Heads 'Popular Favorites 1976-1992/Sand In the Vaseline'
Richard Hell 'Blank Generation'
The Dead Boys 'Young Loud & Snotty'

The Ramones we're among the bands that made CBGB's popular. They have influenced virtualy every area of the rock world. And although they never reached success on their own, they had a big impact on some of the most successful bands of the last 20 years. 'Ramones [Expanded]' Their first LP is considered by many, the first real punk rock record. Other defining punk albums include 'Leave Home [Expanded]', 'Rocket to Russia [Expanded]', 'Road to Ruin [Expanded]', 'Subterranean Jungle'. Their 80's stuff I actually think is better, but they stray from the punk rock sound a bit and move into alot of synth driven work.

The Sex Pistols only released one album, started the british punk movement, and go down in history as one of the biggest bands ever. 'Never Mind the Bollocks Here's the Sex Pistols'. The brits we're more vile and went more into the direction of shocking and appauling. It was alot more rude and crude that the americans. It could be because of the political situation at the time, or just the fact that british people are dicks.

The Damned 'Damned Damned Damned'
Anti-Nowhere League: 'The Best of the Anti-Nowhere League [Cleopatra]'
Sham 69 'Best Of: The Cockney Kids Are Innocent'
Buzzcocks 'Singles Going Steady'
Crass 'Christ the Album'
Exploited 'Punk's Not Dead'
Rudimentary Peni 'Death Church'
Subhumans 'The Day the Country Died'

The Clash we're among one of the british bands to do something different with their music. They used elements of reggae in their sound. 'London Calling' and 'Combat Rock' are their best works.

Of course the US had some pretty shocking bands. GG Allin lived the punk rock lifestyle to the fullest. He was loud, cruel, and offensive to everyone. 'Always Was, Is, and Always Shall Be'
The Plasmatics shocked and appauled the world because of front woman Wendy O' Williams' stage acts. 'Beyond the Valley of 1984'.

The Misfits we're another band that had a great impact in little time. They stuck with the Ramones fast paced and poppy sound but the lyrics we're that out of a bad horror film, which somehow clicked with metalheads. Bridging the gap so to speak.

'Walk Among Us'
'Earth A.D./Die Die My Darling'
'Legacy of Brutality'

The Dead Milkmen we're a great punk band who didn't follow the ways of tradition. 'Death Rides a Pale Cow: The Ultimate Collection'

During the early 80's real punk pretty much fizzled out. Kids across the country we're adopting the punk rock style and thought that a mohawks and some crappy clothes meant that they we're punks. Punk rock was dead to the mainstreem, it survived on it's own in the underground with a Do It Yourself mentallity. Because these guys we're the furthest thing from a record exec's mind. LA was a primary spot for the hardcore bands including, TSOL ('Dance with Me'), Black Flag ('Damaged' & 'My War'), Social Distortion ('Mommy's Little Monster'), Bad Religion ('1980-85'), CircleJerks ('Group Sex'), Adolescents ('The Adolescents'), Fear ('Record'), and the biggest and most unique act of them all Dead Kennedy's ('Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables', 'Frankenchrist', & 'Bedtime for Democracy')
The Descendents we're a band that could do hardcore songs and turn right around play a song about girls, alot like Husker Du. 'Milo Goes to College'

The other big scene was the DC scene, famous for starting the sXe movement.

Minor Threat: 'Complete Discography'

Bad Brains: 'Bad Brains' & 'I Against I'
Minutemen: 'Double Nickels on the Dime'
By the end of the 80's though, alot of the hardcore mentallity had faded out, these bands worked so hard and just needed a break. Doing it yourself takes a toll. So alot of these guys, slowed down, started playing music with the same heart but just a variety of musicianship. Especially Ian Mackeye of Minor Threat fame, who started Fugazi.
Fugazi: '13 Songs' & 'Red Medicine'

One hardcore band, that didn't hail from neither DC nor LA. Was Husker Du from Minnesota of all places. They we're one of the hardest hitting bands in the early 80's but we're belting out melodic tunes by the end of the decade which paved the way for Pop-Punk to take place in the 90's. 'Zen Arcade' & 'Candy Apple Grey'

After the death of hardcore a wave of melodic punk rock came out. Bad Religion broke up in 1985 but resurged in 1988 to release a series of albums that we're nothing but perfect. They took the gritty sound of hardcore punk and made it enjoyable to people who would have never gotten into their old stuff. 'Suffer', 'No Control', & 'Against the Grain' we're the last three albums with the original line-up intact. The band then went through a few changes in the 90's with their albums getting slower and more melodic. The highly successful and very dark 'Generator', and their first 2 major label albums 'Recipe for Hate' & 'Stranger Than Fiction' we're different but awesome in their own way. Lead Guitarist Brett left the band in 1995 and the song writing deterorated. The next 3 albums we're somewhat forgetable, but Brett Rejoined the band in 2001 to record 'The Process of Belief' which was a return to an indie label and an old style.

NOFX was another band to come out of the LA hardcore scene, they used elements of ska in their music, one of the only bands at the time doing that. They're songs we're traditionaly silly and made you chuckle. Like Bad Religion they had their 3 hardest albums at the end of the 80's 'Liberal Animation', 'S & M Airlines', & 'Ribbed'. Their sound also went more towards the melodic side. The albums 'White Trash Two Heebs & A Bean' & 'Punk in Drublic' ushered in a new breed of punk rock. But their albums since have been somewhat mediocre. But they remain at the top of the punk rock echelon

Operation Ivy is considered one of the most influential punk/ska bands ever, they started a whole new trend, with only one LP. 'Operation Ivy (Energy)'

From the remains of OPIV came Rancid, a gritty band from the streets who sound similar to the Clash. 'Let's Go' & '...And Out Come The Wolves' are their strongest efforts.

Pennywise is a band that came along in the early 90's and are very reminscent of that late-80's post-hardcore Bad Religion style. 'Pennywise' & 'Straight Ahead' remain classics.

Many other bands spawned out from the new-school punk like Bouncing Souls: ('Hopeless Romantic'), Strung Out ('Twisted by Design'), The Vandals, ('Hitler Bad, Vandals Good') and Guttermouth: ('Friendly People' & 'Teri Yakimoto')

The street punk sound introduced by Rancid was soon found everywhere in bands like Bombshell Rocks ('Street Art Gallery'), Dropkick Murphy's ('The Singles Collection') , and One Man Army ('Last Word Spoken')

Anti-Flag is a band that took the modern punk sound and mixed it alot with old british punk from the 70's. 'A New Kind of Army' & 'Die for the Government'

The final and most controvertial area of punk rock is POP-PUNK. Bands like the Descendents & Husker Du definately paved the way but the first realy pop-punk bands was none other than Bay area act Green Day. They we're an amazing band, that played melodic songs about girls and the struggles of adolescence. 'Kerplunk', '1039/Smoothed Out Slappy Hour', & 'Nimrod'.

Other bands such as Screeching Weasel ('Anthem for a New Tomorrow'), Mr. T Experience ('Revenge Is Sweet, and So Are You'), & The Queers ('Beyond the Valley...') spent their time doing Ramones styled songs, which definately hit the poppy side of punk but nothing like Green Day did.

The other band that came out around the same time as Green Day but we're never quite successful was No Use For A Name ('Leche Con Carne', & 'More Betterness'). They later paved the way for Lagwagon ('Double Plaidinum'), Swinging Utters ('Juvenile Product of the Working Class'), & Alkaline Trio ('Maybe I'll Catch Fire')

Good Charlotte, Simple Plan, Starting Line, Mest, New Found Glory, Something Corporate, All American Rejects, The Ataris, SR-71, American Hi-Fi, Silverstein, Fenix TX, Zebrahead, Homegrown, Brand New, etc, these bands are not punk rock bands, they are the new-wave on POP-ROCK. It's OK to like these bands, but they are in no way punk rock bands, I don't care if you are a teeny bopper and calling yourself punk would be cool, it has nothing to do with punk rock.

( bei amazon gefunden, geschrieben von Darren Richardson)

 

[robb]

der "godfather of punk" ist legs mcneill. der arsch hat nämlich anfang der 70er in nyc sone zeitung rausgebracht voller splattercomics, titten, maschinengewehren und monstern - so richtig schön geschmacklos eben... und dieses vergehen gegen den guten geschmack hiess (und heisst bis heute) punk magazine... da waren dann auch geschichten über die zu der zeit in new york zu findenden bands drin, also die ramones, die stooges, blondie, patti smith, television etc. also hat man beschlossen, dass die ganze bewegung jetzt punk heisst, was so ziemlich jeden angepisst hat... aber nix zu machen

die ramones sind die punkrockband überhaupt, meines erachtens sind die sex pistols nur der zweite aufguss. legs mcneill hat selber mal gesagt:" wenn du in den staaten erfolg haben willst, dann bring die idee nach england und importier sie von dort". naja, beim punkrock hat's funktioniert...

und lemmy kilmister hat sid vicious ja bassunterricht gegeben... sein comment zu sid auf die frage, was er für ein typ gewesen wäre war angeblich nur "naja, einer der nicht bass spielen konnte, hargh hargh hargh". sagt alles, oder? und deedee war einfach der allercoolste!

gabba gabba hey!

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

Na der Destroyer ist ja en riesen Fachmann.

Seid wann sind die Sex Pistols denn Hardcore Punk, da hätt ich aber mal gerne ne Begründung zu.

*mitwart* beim Wort "Hardcorepunk" muss ich jetzt spontan an Vorkriegsjugend, Zerstörte Jugend, Minor Threat, DRI, Conflict und dergleichen denken...

Ich bitte ferner darum, hier Emo nicht in Verbindung mit Punk Rock zu bringen.
Die Seitenscheitel-Hornbrillen Typen können gerne heulen worüber sie wollen, solange et nich hier ist.

sei nicht so... du verletzt noch ihre Gefühle

 

[Supertyp]

Ooh, wenn ich zu grob war und irgendjemand mit Seitenscheitel und Hornbrille emotional verletzt sein sollte, ists halt passiert.
Schreibt ein Lied drüber.

Aber der Dr. liegt glaub ich nicht so falsch mit Minor Threat und DRI.
The Unseen, SS Decontrol, Total Chaos würd ich auch noch anführen.

Aber hab keine konkrete Vorstellung was Hardcore Punk ausmacht, oder wies entstanden ist.

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

Ooh, wenn ich zu grob war und irgendjemand mit Seitenscheitel und Hornbrille emotional verletzt sein sollte, ists halt passiert.
Schreibt ein Lied drüber.

Aber der Dr. liegt glaub ich nicht so falsch mit Minor Threat und DRI.
The Unseen, SS Decontrol, Total Chaos würd ich auch noch anführen.

Aber hab keine konkrete Vorstellung was Hardcore Punk ausmacht, oder wies entstanden ist.

jaaaaaaaaaa und dann gibts ja noch so Zeug à la Black Flag, Gorilla Biscuits....

 

[Supertyp]

Gorilla Bisquits waren Hardcore.

Die hatten soweit ich weiß nich viel mit Punks am Hut gehabt.

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

hmmm naja für mich ist das Hardcore-Punk aber darüber könnten wir ja stundenlang diskutieren

 

[Supertyp]

Wohl war.

Wär wohl besser gelaufen, wär man damals dabei gewesen.
Dann könnt man jetzt auch neunmal klug tun.

 

[Dr. Oleg REcznski]

man könnte sich auch wiedermal das Buch "Punk-Lexikon" organsieren.. so'ne Bibel wäre sicher was cooles für uns Dogmatiker